Let Muslims of India Answer

[perplexed]

[=red][/color]



Why the Hindus,their establishments and properties are made targets for inflicting Pain and destruction, when A cartoonist or cartoonists of Denmark did a despicable act, when a Shite Mosque is attacked by some one whose identity is unknown, when some Sacrilege is Committed in Holy Mecca, about 20 Years ago, when the sacred relic went missing from HAZRATBAL MOSQUE in Srinagar?



Even in the case of Demolition of BABRI MASJID, why should any one create tensions and Riots in Hyderabad?Is there proof of a single Hyderabadi, partaking in the said demolition?



Is it not a fact that when Muslim Rulers ruled India, the native Indian Languages were relegated to third and fourth positions, even though the Natives constituted 90% of the Population? Were not Hindus treated as second or third grade citizens?



Why not in the Present day secular India, the Hindu Lives and Properties are treated with so much contempt?



Is it not a fact that In Hyderabad, even though the Muslim Population costitutes about 25% of the Total population, when it comes to Crime Statistics, more than 40% crimes are committed by persons who are adherents of Islam?Why is it so?

[samai]

good question. lets see how many of them can answer, truly.



I have a lot of muslim friends and several of them are family friends too who are wonderful, decent and dignified people. I am sure there are several such ones here on this DB too.



I see that there is a slow fire that is erupting between us, let us not allow such differnences between us, what say, you guys? huh?



let us put them, the rest of the world to shame, we hyderabadis.. let us get out and let the whole world know what we feel within, that we ARE fanatic moderates, all of us, hindus, sikhs, muslims, christians, budhists, jews, parsis, ... that we are foremost hyderabadis



and those of them who are just fanatics..let them go to hell.

[rock_26iin]

It's a simple strategy applied by the politicos, which has been goin on since the British : divide and rule. That is the answer in a nutshell.

[perplexed]

Dear SAMAI, I fully concur with you and i too have got some very decent MUSLIM friends.But, my only anguish is that why noty the so called leaders of the community, in the best interests of all hyderabadis, warn against violent/destructive activities. " PANCH UNGLIYA BARABAR NAHI HOTHE" manliye.But, which ever ungli is proving cancerous has to be cured.Mad people, mad dogs,criminals have to be sent to places they deserve. They should not be permitted to endanger lives and spoil the tranquil atmosphere.

[CtrlAltDel]

...when it comes to Crime Statistics, more than 40% crimes are committed by persons who are adherents of Islam...

first of all, where did u get that statistic?



secondly, look at the sociological angle. crime recieves its largest dose of fuel from poverty. quite a considerable number of muslims are economically backward and it shud come as no surprise if quite a good number of them indulge in petty crimes.



remember that crime and poverty are interlinked. do not generalize and attempt to link it to religion.

[gyanster]

Well said CAD.

[Reality]

...when it comes to Crime Statistics, more than 40% crimes are committed by persons who are adherents of Islam...

first of all, where did u get that statistic?

secondly, look at the sociological angle. crime recieves its largest dose of fuel from poverty. quite a considerable number of muslims are economically backward and it shud come as no surprise if quite a good number of them indulge in petty crimes.

remember that crime and poverty are interlinked. do not generalize and attempt to link it to religion.

I think the stats on the crime rates are wrong or must be taken from a RSS or Shiv sena publication. Anyway one more question I always had ,,



Since India was ruled by Muslim rulers for nearly 4 centuries ( atleast a major part of india ) the muslims in the public must have been a favoured class. So the question is , how come we have some many of them living in poverty now?

[Thinking HP]

Since India was ruled by Muslim rulers for nearly 4 centuries ( atleast a major part of india ) the muslims in the public must have been a favoured class. So the question is , how come we have some many of them living in poverty now?

My thoughts on this constantly bring up the following points. This is my analysis on the economically and socially backward section among the muslims. And there are exceptions to whatever I have to say here but the fact remains that these exceptions are still a minority. So, I request fellow members, especially muslims, not to get defensive about whatever I say here and take it as a constructive feedback.



1. Lack of topical education : A huge majority of muslim children are educated in madrassas. And the education provided to them does not confirm to the present day scenario.



2. A straitjacketed approach : Somehow, their approach to various issues is very closed. I've seen time and again that even the well educated lot among muslims are sometimes immune to reason. Examples abound on this board itself. DQ & Jquader are cases in point. This has led to the conservative and more often than not, irrational clergy having gained a considerable clout on the community.



3. The ghetto mentality : Inspite of having been part of the country since centuries, they still see themselves as distant from the rest of the nation. This ghetto mentality has always kept them away from the mainstream and has allowed them to fall prey to votebank politics.



4. Sectarianism : Although viewed as a very united religion, Islam is suffering from a major sectarian disease. You have Shias and Sunnis fighting among themselves, Bohras creating a ghetto of their own within the religion and so on. I can see certain sects among Islam as economically more progressive than the others but hardly do I see their Zakaat being utilised for the betterment of other sects.



My point is that the other communities have changed with times. Have a look around and you'll see this not just among hindus but even other communities which are traditionally viewed as even more conservative than muslims. Here are some examples.



(a) Hindus : The caste system has diluted considerably. And so have other reproachable practices like dowry etc. Majority of hindus have shunned the neo-fascist fundamentalist wing though I still find them culpable of not voicing their poinion strongly at times.



(b) Parsis : The community was fast dwindling due to their tendency to marry within the community, which was in a way corrupting their gene pool. But they have recognised the crisis within and are now encouraging inter-community marriages.



(c) Tribals : There was a time when tribals used to resist the mainstream. But today, you see them active in all walks of life. Although I'm against any kind of coerced conversion, I have to give it to the christian missionaries that they have upped the standard of living of the tribals considerably (its another story that you see the standard of living coming up only among converted tribals but that's besides the point).



Bottomline : Muslims need to awaken to the current times. They need to have a progressive look at their education system, their social setup and their national identity.

[perplexed]

Dear Friends CtrlDelAlt and Reality



Being a Hyderabadi, my statements and statistics mainly pertain to Hyderabad.



Yes, Poverty and Crime are related to some extent.But compare the acts of a poor man who kills to gain and another poor man who despite poverty never thinks to inflict pain for his personal gain.Do all poor people turn to crime?





Coming to Poverty of Muslims, I cite an Analogy, which I understand was being quoted by Abraham Lincoln, in the case of people who cause a situation themselves and use it an alibi to get concession



AN "X" KILLS HIS PARENTS IN A FIT OF ANGER; AND WHEN THE JUDGE SEEKS THE STATEMENT OF "X" THE LATTER PLEADS THAT HE WAS AN ORPHAN AND THE JUDGE SHOULD TAKE PITY ON HIM AND SHOULD BE LENIENT



Likewise, the poverty of Muslims in India, is definitely on account of their shunning Birth Control measures and modern education.If they are wilfully and voluntarily choosing poverty for happiness after death, they should not blame their poverty on people of other religions or the Government.Why should they shun Birth Control measures, when even in Pakistan, Birth Control measues are encouraged.If they deem Birth Control is against the will of GOD, and children are GOD Given, why they are reacting so violently against local people, for acts perpetrated in distant countries over which we have no control whatsoever, and why can't they deem such acts also as will of God and that GOD will teach them(perpetrators of crimes against Islam) a suitable lesson?



Yes, it is a fact that majority Hindus had to pay higher and more taxes on additional counts than the Muslim subjects under Muslim rulers, and the present day poverty/illiteracy/ill-health of Muslims is on account of their refusal to adopt rationalistic attitude with changing times.Should love of GOD lead to lack of care for the growth of the Country which is giving them means of their existence(This is with regard to frequent eruption of law and order problems and destruction of property, be it public or private.)



Any family or community or even individual or business will become poorer, if "resting on oars" stance is adopted and if every subsequent generation does not exerts itself and contributes to conservation and growth. Are we not seeing, rich families slipping into poverty, when individuals of a particular generation indulge in pomp and pleasure, without caring to stem the dwindling riches and wealth?

[CtrlAltDel]

...Since India was ruled by Muslim rulers for nearly 4 centuries ( atleast a major part of india ) the muslims in the public must have been a favoured class. So the question is , how come we have some many of them living in poverty now?[/b]

the biggest reason is that after partition, majority of the educated and rich muslims opted for pakistan. this left no worthwhile leader for the community who cud fight for its improvement.

[lonewolf]

the biggest reason is that after partition, majority of the educated and rich muslims opted for pakistan. this left no worthwhile leader for the community who cud fight for its improvement.

Had they stayed back in India, they could have raised themselves, their community and India to a higher level than it is right now. I don't hear of many educated people in pakistan.

[Reality]

the biggest reason is that after partition, majority of the educated and rich muslims opted for pakistan. this left no worthwhile leader for the community who cud fight for its improvement.

Had they stayed back in India, they could have raised themselves, their community and India to a higher level than it is right now. I don't hear of many educated people in pakistan.

I agree with lonewolf, if pakistan is in the present state with all those educated and rich muslims from india ,, we are better off with our own poor but usually well behaved muslims who stayed back.

[CtrlAltDel]

IMO, pakistan ended up as it is now, coz the policies of successive governments promoted feudalism of the rich who migrated from india.

[HH]

The Poor On Both Sides ... OR ... Anywhere ... Are The SAME! ... Basic Needs Are The SAME! ... Food / Clothing / Shelter ... Religion / Other Distinctions Are IRRELEVANT / Of No Help At ALL! ...