caste 101

[Sharjeel]

Cleaner? who are u kidding man?
u asking us to trust a pommy with cleanliness, if so, u got to be kidding. anyway, i have never been to london, but ask some one who has been there, u ll get an account of how dirty it could be. And they say dharavi is a slum.

This prolly is/was a reflection of the Brits holier than thou attitude.

This is exactly the way the british felt about the inhabitants of both of our countries 150 years ago

Somewhat funny, since Indians have always kept clean, whatever their financial or otherwise status...



Mebbe it looks(ed) different from thier POV.

[vakibs]

Interesting discussion ! First thanks to Mark for putting the proud-dalit out. World will be much better without these flamers.



I want to add a little more information



1) One theory states that the caste system started as a means of avoiding mixture of races - Caucasoid, mongoloid, negroid etc.. (varna-sankaram as it was called) But as pastoral times morphed into feudal times (where agriculture was the main occupation), the 4 varnas were developed. The main reason was to facilitate control over the society where a king reigns supreme in a kingdom. This didnt happen until 500 BC. There were democratic republics (which had no 4 varnas) which existed as late as 600 AD, after which they were absorbed into the major kingdoms.



2) Caste system survived miraculously through the mughal/islamic times. But, these were insecure times for the natives, and as I said, caste definitely survives in insecure minds.



3) Ditto with the british raj. (I am happy they are out of here. Wisecrack, I think we'd have been much poorer and uglier have they been still around)



4) Now in democratic India, there is no reason for caste to exist. It sucks and I hope people will soon grow out of their shells (read castes). Most importantly ... the brahmin lobby, the reddy lobby, the kamma lobby, the yadav lobby, the BC lobby, the SC lobby.. these should be wiped out of the political scene.



5) People who live in roadside huts are mostly SC. The fact that they are still taken advantage of, is a motivation for us to rethink on the methods of reform. Reservations are useless.

[labelle]

. Now in democratic India, there is no reason for caste to exist. It sucks and I hope people will soon grow out of their shells (read castes). Most importantly ... the brahmin lobby, the reddy lobby, the kamma lobby, the yadav lobby, the BC lobby, the SC lobby.. these should be wiped out of the political scene.

5) People who live in roadside huts are mostly SC. The fact that they are still taken advantage of, is a motivation for us to rethink on the methods of reform. Reservations are useless.

You are right on target vakib i already mentioned this point that the caste lobby should be cleared but this is not possible until these power hungry criminal politicians exists there is not a single politician who wants the progress of this country all they want is to fill up their own pocket. i come from a place where the tribal population is the max( Orissa) i have seen situations where the people who have been able to utilise the reservation have been very less even though they are quite talented yet they cannot utilise the facility because they dont even have money to fulfill their bare minimum necessities. i am not favouring anyone all i want to say is that what is the use of all these reservations when people dont even have money for a four square meal. i think trather than emphasizing to which caste a person belongs to or which side of the society he is in we should see whether he is geeting the bare minimum necessities fullfilled .

[mark]

This is exactly the way the british felt about the inhabitants of both of our countries 150 years ago

Somewhat funny, since Indians have always kept clean, whatever their financial or otherwise status...

Mebbe it looks(ed) different from thier POV.

it did.

some people can't see past their own culture to the worth of others. usually they kill and maim in the name of progress and then roll their eyes and say "there's no helping some people"

i'm not saying thats what happened in India, but in south america, north america, and Australia this exact excuse (they're filthy, we try to relocate them, it does no good, etc) was used to cull the indiginous people (who had been there 1000s of years longer than the new races) and destroy their way of life (a way of life far more in tune with nature than our civilisation (or at least it was until we messed them up (by "we" i mean any "advanced" civ))

he thats a lot of brackets.

[Sharjeel]

This is exactly the way the british felt about the inhabitants of both of our countries 150 years ago

Somewhat funny, since Indians have always kept clean, whatever their financial or otherwise status...

Mebbe it looks(ed) different from thier POV.

it did.
some people can't see past their own culture to the worth of others. usually they kill and maim in the name of progress and then roll their eyes and say "there's no helping some people"
i'm not saying thats what happened in India, but in south america, north america, and Australia this exact excuse (they're filthy, we try to relocate them, it does no good, etc) was used to cull the indiginous people (who had been there 1000s of years longer than the new races) and destroy their way of life (a way of life far more in tune with nature than our civilisation (or at least it was until we messed them up (by "we" i mean any "advanced" civ))
he thats a lot of brackets.

This then, must be the 'Caste-System' of the world. Here is something more to fry them brains on:



Forget the fact that 'we' are actually responsible for wiping out 1000 yr old Civs. Look at it from an extremely extended time base...



Is this not nature's way of, say, pulling the plug on people who refused to change with the times, and hung onto their beliefs even though time and nature demanded that they change. Are the 'biggies' being made instruments by nature to flush out unneeded people?



The fact that the people who are getting killed are different (read wierd), and however cruel it might seem, they are still stuck in their own lil worlds. This may be the advanced version opf what is known as 'natural selection' or 'survival of the fittest'.



A Nuke war is guaranteed, I tell ya. The world will de-toxificate and re-invent itself.

[Sharjeel]

This is exactly the way the british felt about the inhabitants of both of our countries 150 years ago

Somewhat funny, since Indians have always kept clean, whatever their financial or otherwise status...

Mebbe it looks(ed) different from thier POV.

it did.
some people can't see past their own culture to the worth of others. usually they kill and maim in the name of progress and then roll their eyes and say "there's no helping some people"
i'm not saying thats what happened in India, but in south america, north america, and Australia this exact excuse (they're filthy, we try to relocate them, it does no good, etc) was used to cull the indiginous people (who had been there 1000s of years longer than the new races) and destroy their way of life (a way of life far more in tune with nature than our civilisation (or at least it was until we messed them up (by "we" i mean any "advanced" civ))
he thats a lot of brackets.

This then, must be the 'Caste-System' of the world. Here is something more to fry them brains on:



Forget the fact that 'we' are actually responsible for wiping out 1000 yr old Civs. Look at it from an extremely extended time base...



Is this not nature's way of, say, pulling the plug on people who refused to change with the times, and hung onto their beliefs even though time and nature demanded that they change. Are the 'biggies' being made instruments by nature to flush out unneeded people?



The fact is that the people who are getting killed are different (read wierd), and however cruel it might seem, they are still stuck in their own lil worlds. This may be the advanced version opf what is known as 'natural selection' or 'survival of the fittest'.



A Nuke war is guaranteed, I tell ya. The world will de-toxificate and re-invent itself.

[proud_dalit]

[b]MARK,

i WOULD LIKE START BY SAYING THAT THE ONLY WAY IT SEEMS YOU BELIEVE YOU CAN FIT YOURSEELF INTO THIS SOCITEY IS BY RIDICULING IN YOU R OWN CULTURE/SOCIETY THIS IS THE STRATEGY USED BY THE WEAK ,I AM SAYING THIS ON THE BASIS OF TH EPOST YOU MADE IN TH EBRAHMINS NOT BETTER DALITS BETTER THREAD.

I'm not ridiculing my own culture you f%ckwit, i'm not british.

The rest of your post is exactly the sort of hate-inspired bullshit i was trying to avoid, and your links are the sort of propaganda that make it hard to find useful information on this online.

ALSO CAPSLOCK'S NOT COOL.

You bloody BPO guy,u think its cool to work in BPO and try to be knowledgeable about the caste system in India,you will get screwed up in the end,when I said you were ridiculing your own culture I meant the Irish culture which you said is not perfect in the other thread.grow up before its too late,and get decieved,what do you think all those Christinas you hang around with in the churches who are they they are the visctims of Brahminism and are dalts sc sts who converted to Christianity,so the impression that you have from the bisased posts by Brahmins here that the caste system is so sool is not so cool after all you SOB.

[proud_dalit]

[b]MARK,

i WOULD LIKE START BY SAYING THAT THE ONLY WAY IT SEEMS YOU BELIEVE YOU CAN FIT YOURSEELF INTO THIS SOCITEY IS BY RIDICULING IN YOU R OWN CULTURE/SOCIETY THIS IS THE STRATEGY USED BY THE WEAK ,I AM SAYING THIS ON THE BASIS OF TH EPOST YOU MADE IN TH EBRAHMINS NOT BETTER DALITS BETTER THREAD.

I'm not ridiculing my own culture you f%ckwit, i'm not british.

The rest of your post is exactly the sort of hate-inspired bullshit i was trying to avoid, and your links are the sort of propaganda that make it hard to find useful information on this online.

ALSO CAPSLOCK'S NOT COOL.

You bloody BPO guy,u think its cool to work in BPO and try to be knowledgeable about the caste system in India,you will get screwed up in the end,when I said you were ridiculing your own culture I meant the Irish culture which you said is not perfect in the other thread.grow up before its too late,and get decieved,what do you think all those Christinas you hang around with in the churches who are they they are the visctims of Brahminism and are dalts sc sts who converted to Christianity,so the impression that you have from the bisased posts by Brahmins here that the caste system is so sool is not so cool after all you SOB.

[vakibs]

are u really a dalit. or some freaka*$ masquerading as one. whatever, you are disgracing dalits and indians in general.

[proud_dalit]

are u really a dalit. or some freaka*$ masquerading as one. whatever, you are disgracing dalits and indians in general.

Yes I am a dalit and I ama proud one ,not under the cluthces of the Brahminsa free dalit which is what people like you dont want to see I know its disgraceful to you to see a dalit independent and proud and take on many brahmins at one single time.

[Lucifer]

Time for Lucifer to make a post on this thread. Before that, a remark: Et tu, Mark?



These debates on caste have escalated from cordial ones to ones of heavy confrontation. The spirit of a healthy discussion is completely missing. I would not like to refer to anyone in particular, but this confrontationalist attitude is improper, not just in a public forum but in life in general.



I have nothing against people saying what they want to but there are ways in which something harsh can be put that does not hurt or aggravate anyone. For instance if I had to say something about the movie Bewafaa I could say it in either of the two ways.



1. Bewafaa makes you wonder if walking your neighbour's dog was a more enjoyable indulgence.



2. Bewafaa clearly demonstrates the imbecility and incapability of the film-makers in India.



Both these statements convey that the movie sucks. But the first one does so politely. Perhaps we should spend some time before we hit the submit button because the written word, unlike the spoken one, is interpreted solely the way the reader wants to do it.

[vakibs]

I wish to keep with the spirit shown by lucifer .. (I would have preferred a bolder language though)



p_d u should channelize ur energies in something productive. why not do research in molecular biology and discover vaccines .. eh ? mark is a curious guy who likes to know about our culture so give him facts not ur attitude , even if u have a real glorious opinion about urself. Also I think u should play a few games in the evening - good for exercise and relieves the latent bdsm tendencies in u. try basketball ?

[mark]

This is exactly the way the british felt about the inhabitants of both of our countries 150 years ago

Somewhat funny, since Indians have always kept clean, whatever their financial or otherwise status...

Mebbe it looks(ed) different from thier POV.

it did.
some people can't see past their own culture to the worth of others. usually they kill and maim in the name of progress and then roll their eyes and say "there's no helping some people"
i'm not saying thats what happened in India, but in south america, north america, and Australia this exact excuse (they're filthy, we try to relocate them, it does no good, etc) was used to cull the indiginous people (who had been there 1000s of years longer than the new races) and destroy their way of life (a way of life far more in tune with nature than our civilisation (or at least it was until we messed them up (by "we" i mean any "advanced" civ))
he thats a lot of brackets.

This then, must be the 'Caste-System' of the world. Here is something more to fry them brains on:

Forget the fact that 'we' are actually responsible for wiping out 1000 yr old Civs. Look at it from an extremely extended time base...

Is this not nature's way of, say, pulling the plug on people who refused to change with the times, and hung onto their beliefs even though time and nature demanded that they change. Are the 'biggies' being made instruments by nature to flush out unneeded people?

The fact is that the people who are getting killed are different (read wierd), and however cruel it might seem, they are still stuck in their own lil worlds. This may be the advanced version opf what is known as 'natural selection' or 'survival of the fittest'.

A Nuke war is guaranteed, I tell ya. The world will de-toxificate and re-invent itself.

"advanced" would be living in a sustainable way. you really think our civ is sustainable? These tribes have been operating in harmony with their surroundings since the stone age. And that survival of the fitest arguement could be used to condone anything from Hitlers holocaust to Stalins death camps.



anyway if you really see them as less human that you then there's nothing i can do about it.

[CtrlAltDel]

...I know its disgraceful to you to see a dalit independent and proud and take on many brahmins at one single time.

:lol:



makes me laff...!



"independent and proud"? u dalits can call yrself that on the day u stop depending on govt. jobs, charity/reservation and get out of yr persecution complex all of u suffer from.



try to come up in life via honest and hard work intead of thru the back door (reservation)...and then proclaim how independent and proud u are.



even tho u seem to have educated yrself and come up in life yr gutter mentality still keeps u as u wud have been 100 yrs ago.

[Portuguese Man-Of-War]

TREAT EVEN A RAPIST BRAHMIN PRIEST AS OUR FATHER,THIS IS IN THE RELIGIOUS BOOK BHAGVAD GITA,IT ALSO SAYS THAT ALL THE OTHER CASTES WERE CRATED TO SERVE TRHE BRAHMIN CASTS AND THEY DID SO AND ARE STILL DOING EVER SINCE THEY CAME INTO THE CLUTCHE SOF BRAHMINS.

THE BHAGWADGITA ALSO GOES ONTO SAY THAT BRAHMINS WERE BORN FROOM THE HEAD OF THE GOD AND WE SUDRAS THE SO CALLED LOWER CASTE WERE BORN FROM THE FEET OF THE GOD SYMBOLIZING THE SUPERIOROTY OF BRAHMINS.

Really ? The Gita says that?



I've long since understood that you do not read parts of others' posts that you do not want to, but again, just tell us the chapter and verse of the Gita that says that thing about being born at the head or the feet. Or where it says that other castes were created to serve the brahmins.



Do you know that it's a crime to spread malicious lies about any religion or religious text in India? That it can get you in jail?



Don't worry, I don't think anybody here will report you - it's not worth it. And in any case, you are not capable of committing any real crimes - you'll spend your life writing filth on public forums basking in the anonymity of the Internet. Now look up 'basking' and 'anonymity' in Webster.

[san]

The title kept me off this thread for long. I say caste def in room 101. Anyway, if I still remember Mark's question, yes on a practical level, caste plays a big role in Indian society. Although young ones hesitate asking the question directly, most uncles and aunties will ask sooner or later. At lot of the time you hear people referring to the caste as well as the person they wish to point out.

[mark]

The title kept me off this thread for long. I say caste def in room 101. Anyway, if I still remember Mark's question, yes on a practical level, caste plays a big role in Indian society. Although young ones hesitate asking the question directly, most uncles and aunties will ask sooner or later. At lot of the time you hear people referring to the caste as well as the person they wish to point out.

haha, i meant caste 101 in a the American sense, like Tech 101, meaning Introduction to Tech. Not in the orwellian room 101 sense

[san]

The title kept me off this thread for long. I say caste def in room 101. Anyway, if I still remember Mark's question, yes on a practical level, caste plays a big role in Indian society. Although young ones hesitate asking the question directly, most uncles and aunties will ask sooner or later. At lot of the time you hear people referring to the caste as well as the person they wish to point out.

haha, i meant caste 101 in a the American sense, like Tech 101, meaning Introduction to Tech. Not in the orwellian room 101 sense

haha to you too



ab jao aur padai karo